home   about   shop   reviews   news archive   forum   ordering   contact   links

Go Back   Overclockers NZ Forums > Hardware > Cooling

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 15-09-2007, 05:18 PM   #1
{.bLanK} GoD
5Ghz Club
 
{.bLanK} GoD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,073
Send a message via ICQ to {.bLanK} GoD Send a message via MSN to {.bLanK} GoD
Sub Zero Motherboard Insulation Guide.

It is about time more people got the sub zero cooling addiction.
So I wrote this guide to help those planning to join our fruity little club.

First I will explain why we need to insulate, then how it is done properly.

Just like when you take a can of drink out of the fridge and introduce it to atmospheric temperature and humidity, condensation will form on the outside of the can. This happens because vaporized water in the air condenses into liquid water on the cold surface.
Here is a chart that shows when moisture will condense at a given temperature and humidity.


We have to protect our gear from the worst case humidity scenario. Here in NZ we very rarely see 90-95% relative humidity, but in that situation you can see on the chart that condensation will form on a surface about 3°C less than the ambient air temperature. Therefore I recommend anybody planning on going Sub ambient cooling will need to insulate their beloved hardware.

The secret to a condensation free insulation job, is to have a completely air tight seal over every piece that will get cold. If air can get in, then so can moisture. Under the freezing point condensation will freeze and not be a problem, it is when that frost thaws and turns into water that it will possibly short something out.

Tools we are going to need are as follows:
Sharp Knife.
Small flat head screwdriver.
Cutting board.
Pen.

And materials:
Closed cell insulation in varies sizes.
Liquid electrical tape or nail polish.
Thermal compound (preferably Arctic Céramique).
Dielectric grease.
Piece of paper.
Toothpicks.

Now there are several steps involved in insulating, this is how I do it. Everybody does it slightly different though.
First of all we need to seal off the socket area so if we do end up with any condensation, we don't end up with water in direct contact with any electrical parts. Electricity and water do not go well together.
I do this by applying liquid electrical tape around the socket area.


I use liquid electrical tape because it is just as good at insulating as anything else and is very easy to remove. But it is more expensive than nail polish. 118ml tin from Jaycar for a little over $20.
Alternatively you can use nail polish or conformal coating.
With Liquid electrical tape or nail polish, be very careful not to drip anything in the socket itself, or else it is most likely going to be a dead motherboard. It is not a bad idea leaving the CPU or CPU cover in the socket.
If the brush is too big to get into those little gaps, use a toothpick to apply a couple of drops at a time.


Conformal coating is usually sprayed on so extra care is needed to mask up the socket and every other connecting on the board. I.e. rear plugs, header pins, bios battery, jumpers, power connections peripheral slots etc.
Several coats may be required to get a nice thick layer isolating everything around the socket. Leave approximately 10 minutes between coats, and a day after the final coat.
Also coat the back side of the board directly behind the socket like so.


Once dry we can start on cutting our closed cell insulation to fit snug.
Cut a rectangle piece of 6mm closed cell insulation to fit between all the major components around the socket. In this example the ram slots, Northbridge, PWM Heat sink and the top edge of the motherboard.


Trace that piece of insulation onto a piece of white paper, cut it out and place on the motherboard in position.


Holding the paper firmly in position, press down around all the components to make an impression on the paper of the bits that need cutting around.


Outline the impression with a pen.
The insulation has quite a bit of squish in it so we want to make our cut outs slightly smaller than the component.


Cut these bits out with a sharp knife and place over the socket to make sure it will fit.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Growly
I won't judge them, I won't impose on them or their actions, but I will stare and take photos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by imdying View Post
TK one little squad of 8 guys up and you're branded for life... sheesh
{.bLanK} GoD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-09-2007, 05:19 PM   #2
{.bLanK} GoD
5Ghz Club
 
{.bLanK} GoD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,073
Send a message via ICQ to {.bLanK} GoD Send a message via MSN to {.bLanK} GoD
Trace our paper template onto our piece of 6mm insulation and cut out with a sharp knife. I use a brand new blade every time I cut a new gasket, a blunt blade is no good as it will just tear the insulation.



This piece of insulation is often called a gasket, because it is sealing off the socket area from air. It can be a bit tricky to get in. Practice makes perfect. Use a small flathead screwdriver to push it into the gaps. If it has been cut out properly it should squeeze into all the gaps nice and firm. Careful not to tear the insulation, or it may not seal properly.



Before the next layer of insulation (which will cover the socket lever), for an extra precaution of shorting out your CPU, it is common to use a dielectric grease in the socket. With a good sealing gasket, dielectric grease is not needed, but i recommend first timers to use it as an extra precaution. Vaseline is a common alternative, but I am unsure as to the long term effects of petroleum based jelly on the motherboard.
With ZIF sockets, grease can be applied with your finger, pushing it into the socket , 775 sockets are best applied with a syringe.
FYI, dielectric means "non conductive"

Now we need another template, this time an outline of the IHS or CPU core for those without heat spreaders.


This time we want the insulation cut slightly bigger than the IHS or CPU core as we don't want any insulation to get between the IHS and evap, pot or block bolting down to it. This piece of is cut out of a piece of 3mm thick closed cell insulation to bring the height of the gasket approximately 1-2mm above the height of the IHS.


Push the mounting bolts through the back side of the board and through the insulation while holding the front side firmly in place.
Now the rear insulation and backing plate can be attached.
I use another piece of 6mm insulation directly on the board with the backing plate clamping it in place.


Now we are ready for our cooling device to bolt down.


Recommended thermal compound is Arctic Céramique, it works better than AS5 under negative temperatures and is also an electrical insulator.
Up to this point, this is more than sufficient for a SS unit or temp down to about -50°C.
For Dry Ice and LN2, I use a piece of 16mm insulation to further insulate the back side of the board. I cut it slightly bigger than the size of the board and the board sits on it for the duration of the benching session.
Using the second template, cut a paper towel and place that down over the second layer gasket before your pot goes on. This will help soak up any ice that thaws out later on.

I hope this helps some people and we see more people pushing their hardware to the extremes.
I'd like to keep this thread clean and on topic.
Spammers will be punished!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Growly
I won't judge them, I won't impose on them or their actions, but I will stare and take photos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by imdying View Post
TK one little squad of 8 guys up and you're branded for life... sheesh
{.bLanK} GoD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-09-2007, 05:20 PM   #3
{.bLanK} GoD
5Ghz Club
 
{.bLanK} GoD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,073
Send a message via ICQ to {.bLanK} GoD Send a message via MSN to {.bLanK} GoD
Reserved for further information.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Growly
I won't judge them, I won't impose on them or their actions, but I will stare and take photos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by imdying View Post
TK one little squad of 8 guys up and you're branded for life... sheesh
{.bLanK} GoD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2008, 10:43 PM   #4
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
About time I posted in here.

I do almost eveything the same, but here it is.

As most would know I use nail polish for insulating around the socket, caps, back of the board etc etc.

On the back side of the board I also use a heater pad.




First layer of insulation.


Paper towel gasket to catch and absorb any drips or moisture that may occur around the cpu.


2nd layer of insulation.


3rd and large layer of insulation.






Add Ceramique (thermal interface material)


Mount Pot.

Last edited by Deanzo : 10-05-2008 at 07:55 AM.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2008, 10:28 AM   #5
ColinPowell
Secretary of State (ret.)
 
ColinPowell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NZ
Posts: 2,179
How much of the insulation do you strip down between bench sessions Deanzo? Do you leave the lagging on the pot?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumass
Anyway, I drive these f***tards around in my van and we solve mysteries and ****.
ColinPowell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2008, 10:46 AM   #6
wuzy
vmod manic
 
wuzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NZ
Posts: 396
I see you've switched to a Maximus Extreme now. Nice!
But was there any particular reason to choose that board over P5E3 Premium or X48T-DQ6 or even StrikerII Extreme/790i reference(if decided to go SLI in future) for LN2 benching?
Assuming price and availability wasn't a problem.

[EDITED]
What about the BlackOps? Isn't there one available overseas?
[EDITED2]
NM, I see you're already keeping an eye on it here.
__________________
Server: Phenom II X4 945 95W | MSI 790FX-GD70 | Crucial DDR3-1333 2x2GB | Matrox 2D PCI gfx (PM me GoD) | TT Toughpower 600W | 320GB + 4x1TB | Dell PERC 5/i 512MB+BBU | Intel Pro/1000 PT Dual | Avermedia TwinStar 2xDVB-T |
HTPC: E6300 | XFX GeForce9300 mATX | G.SKILL 2x2GB DDR2-1000 | Slim BD-ROM | 500GB |

Last edited by wuzy : 10-05-2008 at 01:41 PM.
wuzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2008, 06:48 PM   #7
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColinPowell View Post
How much of the insulation do you strip down between bench sessions Deanzo? Do you leave the lagging on the pot?
As a rule, I pull the whole thing apart and dry it out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wuzy View Post
I see you've switched to a Maximus Extreme now. Nice!
But was there any particular reason to choose that board over P5E3 Premium or X48T-DQ6 or even StrikerII Extreme/790i reference(if decided to go SLI in future) for LN2 benching?
Assuming price and availability wasn't a problem.

[EDITED]
What about the BlackOps? Isn't there one available overseas?
[EDITED2]
NM, I see you're already keeping an eye on it here.
The Maximus Extreme is a hell of a board, anyone that gives DDR3 and X38 a hard time needs to try it.
One of the best boards I've used, though it has a cold boot issue @ -90 so it's not for me.
A P5E3 Premium WiFi-AP should land sometime next week for me to play with.
With anyluck, after I'm done playing with that for a week Black Ops will be out.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2008, 04:01 PM   #8
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
I'll put this in here for now, but may move it later.

Right then kids!

You've been sub zero cooling your cpu and now want to take the next step.

Good for you!

Please note, this can make sub zero cooling on a CPU look and feel easy.

First thing, most everyone who does this kills a card at some point and time. A friend of mine has killed two 8800GTX's and two 8800GTS (G92's) this year.
And no, he doesn't get them free .
But if the big clocks/speeds matter to you, this is the next step.

As I didn't take many pictures of my 88U, I'll use the GX2 (Oh the fun, two PCB's )

First off take the card apart.

Not all cards are the same, google your card and see if you can find a "how to"
For the GX2, you can use this one http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Z...800_GX2/4.html
This first step can take over an hour on it's own (mine sure did)



After you have it apart, give it a good clean. And Coat the areas around the core and mem with liquid electrical tape or nail polish, both sides, front and back.
You will need to heatsink the digital vreg chips on each PCB as well as the monitor output chip. And make a gasket(s) to go around the core(s)



Make sure you insulate your pot well.

But think about what your insulation will push up against. To fat, it may just kill that item ie: vmem





Now mount the pot to the card, and if your really lucky. You'll have some POS sli bridge getting in the way


Last edited by Deanzo : 27-05-2008 at 04:26 PM.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2008, 04:10 PM   #9
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
The back of the PCB(s) will get very cold, so you will need to insulate that as well. Or you'll have ice/condensation issues, and then the water will run down the card and into the PCI-e slot. And that's bad

I use two layers, the first layer is just plan closed cell insulation.





2nd layer is the black sticky back insulation, make it over sized to stop air getting in and under the first layer.







One last step, The Motherboard

You will need to insulate around the PCI-e slot with liquid electrical tape or nail polish, front and back.

Rub some vaneline or dielectric gease onto both side of the "gold fingers" that go into the PCI-e slot, and a "small" amount onto the top of the slot itself.

Also pack paper towels around the slot.



Well done, and now test your handy work.




Last edited by Deanzo : 27-05-2008 at 05:05 PM.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2008, 11:48 PM   #10
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
Now that we have looked at both CPU and GPU Cooling, It's time for the NB.

Over all, very easy.

Just like the CPU, we need to make a gasket, but this time a little bigger.



Added two paper towel gaskets.



Another layer of insulation.



Last layer of insulation and the hold down.



Add the top part of the insulation.



I used 10mm insulation under the back plate.



Add some other heatsinks for the SB and FET's, and your ready to go.



And then have some fun!


Last edited by Deanzo : 24-08-2008 at 02:03 PM.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2008, 08:59 AM   #11
Craig
Registered User
 
Craig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: A Team
Posts: 3,916
Wow, how does the Northbridge handle the -temps.
__________________
Gigabyte GA-EX58 Extreme | I7 920 D0 @ 4.2 | Thermalright True Black 120 | OCZ Blade DDR3 2000 7-8-7-20 | Asus GTX280 x3 Tri-SLI | Corsair HX1,000 Watt | Silverstone TJ10 Wesa Black | Samsung Syncmaster 2493HM LCD | Geforce 3D Vision Glasses | Samsung Syncmaster 2233RZ 120Hz LCD
Craig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2008, 12:47 PM   #12
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig View Post
Wow, how does the Northbridge handle the -temps.
I only went as low as -184 and had no issue at all.
Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-02-2009, 09:09 PM   #13
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
I've moved away from using nail polish for insulating around the board.
Using a conformal coating on both sides, is faster, better and costs alot less.

You can pick up a can at JayCars for about $12, and should do 10+ boards. Which is alot better than the $25 each board that nail polish was costing me.

Just take off all the heatsinks etc, tape it out and spray! It's that easy.







Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-03-2009, 08:38 PM   #14
Deanzo
If in doubt, Freeze it!
 
Deanzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,026
Yet another way to insulate your board to stop condensation (air getting in)

Use "Art Eraser" to cover the board, there is no way air is getting in and under this stuff.

In the picture below I'm getting ready to mount a NB pot.

Deanzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2009, 01:36 PM   #15
{.bLanK} GoD
5Ghz Club
 
{.bLanK} GoD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,073
Send a message via ICQ to {.bLanK} GoD Send a message via MSN to {.bLanK} GoD
Are you using the electrolube DCA Dean?
If you read through the data sheet, it recommends baking it on @ about 90°C.
If you want you can use my purpose built bake oven.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Growly
I won't judge them, I won't impose on them or their actions, but I will stare and take photos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by imdying View Post
TK one little squad of 8 guys up and you're branded for life... sheesh
{.bLanK} GoD is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +12. The time now is 10:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.